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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Re: Honda ES6500 timing belt

A little history on the ES 6500 serial number 1073600:
A friend bought it new in the 80's.
He kept it inside and he never used it.
He passed away and some time afterwards his widow called and asked it I wanted to buy it.
I have run it for 15 hours.
In the back of my mind I am thinking does the timing belt need to be changed?
I mean it is 35 years old.
So what do you guys think, Should I change it?
 

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Typically small single cylinder consumer engines don't use a timing belt.
You could do a search for honda gx390 parts diagram. That would give you an internal engine view as well as parts numbers and pricing.
 

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A little history on the ES 6500 serial number 1073600:
...
So what do you guys think, Should I change it?
Here's the link to your parts diagrams: https://peparts.honda.com/powerequipment#/browse/gg/es/es6500/ES6500K1-A_B

Your owners manual does not discuss any necessary maintenance interval for the timing belt: http://cdn.powerequipment.honda.com/pe/pdf/manuals/31ZA0720.pdf

It looks like Honda may regard the belt as a lifetime widget. If it has only double digit hours on it, it's probably still OK. Pop the timing belt cover off and inspect it; if it's not cracked, you're good. The part number is 14400-ZA0-003 BELT, TIMING.
https://www.boats.net/product/honda/14400-ZA0-003?gclid=CjwKCAiA98TxBRBtEiwAVRLqu2XPb9M3vQXLVpvSR358ljXRURGU34eb3YxY3eQYsWkj77CpQpz_BBoCyRIQAvD_BwE

Note that there's a service bulletin re: the timing jumping on your machine: https://www.smokstak.com/forum/threads/honda-em6500-jumping-time.127537/#post-983910

Here's a video on the belt replacement:
 

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Typically small single cylinder consume engines don't use a timing belt.
You could do a search for honda gx390 parts diagram...
The ES6500 has a GX360 water cooled twin and does have a timing belt (see above post).
 

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The ES6500 has a GX360 water cooled twin and does have a timing belt (see above post).
Apparently so. And very cool on a small engine. I guessed this was the 390; Honda is full of surprises. Honestly, this is a prime example why Honda asks for, and deserves, a premium sales price.
Thanks,tabora.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Thank you Tabora for the info and the video.
After watching the video, I will pull the cover and check for cracks in the belt probably after the weather warms enough to work outside.
However, I am near 80 years old and I no longer have the tools or energy to attack the total belt replacement.
The generator is a well designed unit and runs so quiet I hate to let it die.
I do not need it as I have a Generac 16 KW unit with transfer switch.
I installed a Generac 14 KW eleven years ago. It died a fatal death last year after keeping our home in electricity for many power failures.
If I find that the belt is cracked from age, I will ask the guys at the local shop to replace it.
There is one further question I have: Should I replace the water pump while the unit is open?
I appreciate the info and I certainly appreciate the forum.
 

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Should I replace the water pump while the unit is open?
That's a pricier part; I'm guessing that since it has always been immersed that it is probably in pretty good health after so few hours. I'd not do it unless the flow/temperature of the unit was compromised.
 

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oh yea change the time belt!!
get a deal on the parts with the coupon and site link on poust usa
parts fish has the parts deals!!
and they are out of Omaha Nebraska!!
good bunch of guys, and yea you can order right online!!
you need the exact model and serial numbers off the gen and motor.

belts are a 10 year max thing on honda…
and yes they do blow up the engine if they let go at running speed!!
take your time, and set every thing perfect!! watch your time marks.

they use the belts also on the eu2000i and eu2200i gensets.

they dry rot with time just like on a car time belt..

they are worth the time to replace them!!

inspect what you have now... if it has cracks any where on the belt, replace it fast!!
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks for the guidance.
I will open the ES 6500 later this spring and as iowagold suggested I will probably replace the aged belt.
No need to let the valves smash into the piston at full throttle.
The thoughts I have are as the maintenance is so involved I think I will go for a new pump and "O" ring.
There has to be some corrosion in the pump after sitting and not being run for all these years and it is also the tensioner for the belt.
Total cost is only $150 to add to the life if the little unit.
And if I later decide to sell it I will feel safe assuring the buyer that the unit is properly maintained.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Update:
I ordered the new timing belt, water pump and "O" ring.
Cost was $161.00 including NC tax and shipping.
I picked up a new air impact yesterday along with a puller for the flywheel.
Cost about $40.
After looking at the video provided by tabora, I am thinking I will get started when the weather turns warmer.
I will let all know how it turns out.
 

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cool!
at least you have the parts!!
so at least if things go wrong with the other gen you can fix it!!
and get back up running.

and it is nice to have an extra gen on hand!!
you never know if the church or some one else will need a gen during an outage event!

lol you can never have too many tools in my book!! GRIN!!
they are a good investment!!
as long as you can keep them from walking off!!

I also keep plenty of spare parts on hand like spare oil, plugs, filters etc for the gens.
you never know if we might have a long term outage where parts might be an issue as well!!
 

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One suggestion. Mark the the belt and tooth of the cam and crank pulleys with paint pen and transfer to the new belt. I’ve never done a timing belt on a em6500 but I’ve done dozens of car timing belts, and sometimes factory timing marks suck. It’s an easy piece of insurance.
 

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lol on marks!!
and check them by role over several times by hand as the tension changes the belt!!
yea the honda gens and engines are pretty good to work on...
lol
glad the time belts are a 10 year thing!!
on the small units it is a case split to get to the belt...
a bit of work, but at 10 years it is a good time to take a look!!
hey make sure you use a magnetic drain plug!!
they sure do help on the dark trash in the oil!!
 

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Discussion Starter #14
OK, so I ordered the new belt, water pump and gasket from Amazon.
Then I ordered a AVR and waited for two months for arrival.
I finally asked for a refund, and they promptly did so.
Now the weather has reached a tolerable temp but pollen is fierce.
I got my outside projects complete and plan to begin the inside project Monday morning.
I will begin with draining the water.
I am looking forward to beginning.
 

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OK, so I ordered the new belt, water pump and gasket from Amazon.
Then I ordered a AVR and waited for two months for arrival.
I finally asked for a refund, and they promptly did so.
Now the weather has reached a tolerable temp but pollen is fierce.
I got my outside projects complete and plan to begin the inside project Monday morning.
I will begin with draining the water.
I am looking forward to beginning.
hummm avr from jina??
could be the shut down affecting the parts over there.
so far most parts are still in the pipeline...
that could be an issue in the next 6 months!
we need another 30 days here in the states to see where we are...
so far the reported numbers are still on the rise...
makes me wonder how many are non reported self Q folks...
take care all!!
and stay safe!!

take your time on the project.. clean and steady is the key!
after you have done it once.. if you have to split a case next time it is faster!!
with power tools a strip down is just a few min..
and a bit longer to put back together as you clean parts as you go.

setup in an area where you can do this with out moving parts.
card board works well for punch thru templates for bolt location and you can write on the card board for notes.
it is the bolt length thing...
and baggies and a marker work well too!
take your smart phone and shoot pix too.
that some times helps with wire routing or clips etc.



just a few tips from some one who tears down lots of gear.
it sure helps when you go back together to have notes or pix.

have fun!!
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
Well I have the belt installed and the water pump also. I have not run it yet.
I found that the water pump "O" ring had leaked. It corroded a place on the backplate.
I had a difficult time getting the "O" ring to stay in place, but I finally solved that.
That pump was a genuine bitch to change.
There were four 6.1 X 10 mm bolts and one entered the back under the exhaust manifold.
It was impossible to touch with more than the ends of two fingers.
That was no fun.
I took a picture of the pump. The impeller is corroded.
The bearings in the pump seem to be good.
The belt looked almost new. It had no cracks and was tight.
Tomorrow will be the test.
For now I am going to unlax!
7665
 

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yea if you plan on green anti freeze in there change it every 3 years...
maybe some block flush might be a good idea..

thinking scale maybe head gasket?
is that just a water jacket or water head also?
if it is just a water jacket you are ok..
anti freeze may to have never been changed on that unit...
it can go acidic and eat at gaskets and aluminum as well..

what is the capacity on the antifreeze???
they make some super long life stuff..
might be a good idea..
and use distilled water just like you would for a battery.
that no minerals thing.. for the aluminum parts.

rust could be from the lube in the anti freeze breaking down over time..
or from sitting partial empty on antifreeze..
hard to tell.
at least it is back together now!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
I replaced the green antifreeze with pink MBenz antifreeze. It is for alum engines.
As to erosion on the heads and the alunimum parts, the pump housing is not showing any erosion nor did the area where the pump mounted.
Evidentently the impeller did not stand up to the acid in the antifreeze.
Notice the pic.
 

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good choice!
yea any of the Toyota or benz antifreeze that is super long life is a good choice!!
they make test kits for anti freeze acid now...
but on this small stuff just change it every 4-10 years depending on the antifreeze type.
one of the neat things I have seen

they use engine oil on some diesels now for the coolant.
kinda cool... but costly oil change as it is a shared system.
and diesel run away is an issue if you crack a head, block, or loose a head gasket on a hot day.
now if that was on a gasoline engine...
it might be cool to not boil over or have to worry about the change due to break down on antifreeze...
and it will not freeze.
so maybe a 0-10 wt oil for antifreeze?
that is a thought for engine mfg!!
and use an oil cooler with temp valve and exterior oil pump.
they might be able to run higher block temps for better fuel burn and less emissions as well.
just a thought for new engine design!!
 

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Discussion Starter #20
I poured a gallon of non ethenol in the tank this morning.
Fired up right off.
Purrs like a kitten.
 
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