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Hi Sixto:

While I'm waiting for the plumber to get back to me regarding the NG hookup, I'm trying to work through what else needs to be done.

You previously mentioned you needed to change to a different regulator, and also disable auto-choke. I don't know what my NG pressure is, so I'm not going to worry about the regulator just yet. Should I wait to see if I have any issues before disabling auto-choke, or is this something that should definitely be done when running on NG? I've been looking at my original carb. After disconnecting the electrical connection, I should manually turn the actuator on top of the carb so the the vane is fully open, correct?

What's the procedure for setting the load block? The CMD instructions say to turn the screw full in, then back it out 1/4 turn for each horsepower of engine rating. So for the eu6500 that should be ~12HP x 1/4 turn = 3 full turns. But how do I verify that's the correct setting? Do I turn the screw in or out at idle until the engine smooths out? Or are adjustments done with the generator loaded?

BTW, thanks so much for all the help!

-dan
Yeah, don't worry about the regulator, it was just a theory that I had, but not sure that the different regulator changed anything.

For the disable of the auto-choke it definitely helped me starting. I disconnected it and did the following:
As you're looking at it from the front, with the panel door open, you should push it to the left, clockwise if looking from the top.

I haven't tried mine in a couple of weeks, but the last few times it started right up.
Here's what I did with the load block:
Good question, my reference has been the number of grooves in the load block screw from the open end of the screw to the load block lock nut. For me, for the CMD kit, it's 10 screw grooves. I use a pointy object or screwdriver to count the screw grooves.
I fgured this out by finding the most closed state that ran smoothly, then applying load and opening it up little by little to just keep it purring nicely.
 

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Sixto - with regard to fully opening the disabled choke - with the side door open, do you push the black plastic tab fully forward until it stops?
 

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I won't be able to test anything until I get the plumber to do the NG hookup, but I followed the CMD instructions for setting the load block - screw all the way in, then back out 1/4 turn for each HP of the engine.

This exposed 6 grooves between the lock nut and top of screw. I know Sixto said he has ~10 grooves exposed. I'll post back once I get to try it out...
 

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I won't be able to test anything until I get the plumber to do the NG hookup, but I followed the CMD instructions for setting the load block - screw all the way in, then back out 1/4 turn for each HP of the engine.

This exposed 6 grooves between the lock nut and top of screw. I know Sixto said he has ~10 grooves exposed. I'll post back once I get to try it out...
Good luck!
 

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Another tri-fuel 6500

I too just recently received my 6500 from CMD. I also want to thank everyone on here for all the great information about getting this thing set up and running properly. I live in a rural area and will be using propane, since I have a 500 gal tank in my yard.

dkuster, when I got my generator from CMD, the load block was already set properly. CMD probably tested it and left it adjusted.

That being said, the adjustment was a full 7 turns from closed, which is a LOT more than the 1/4 round per HP that was listed in their instructions. So your mileage may vary. Fortunately for me, when I started adjusting mine for propane I screwed it closed, but counted the turns when I did that. Then tried the 1/4 turn per HP, couldn't get it started, then decided to try what it was set at when I got it (7 full turns) and it fired right up.

It does seem to be hard to start when cold, hence I will probably be modifying the auto-choke per the instructions from Sixto (thanks for that!). I would like to figure out a way to put a switch in the auto-choke as I might want to use it on gasoline once in a while. I might just put a toggle switch inside the cover on the wire and/or if I could put a connector inline with the wire that I could just disconnect that might work too. I don't anticipate changing it that often, but as sure as I disconnect it I'll have a need to run it on gasoline for some reason.
 

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EU6500is on LPG - with Central Maine Diesel tri-fuel conversion

Thanks all for all the good conversion advice. Purchased my UE6500 in July 2012 and converted to LPG in November 2012. Instructions - crap, but figured it out. Would NEVER start on LPG. So for a year and 2,800 hours, I have been starting on gasoline and then converting to LPG while running. A manual pain in the butt that makes the remote start feature impossible.

I cannot wait disable the auto-choke and see what impact this has.

As for advice to others about the conversion.
a) buy a couple of extra air box clips
b) use the long screwdriver and tape method for the back clip
c) get a magnet retriever before you start

In general - EU6500is is the best genny in the world. Love the machine. Reliable, quiet, efficient. Cant wait to see how long it will last. 5,000 hours? 10,000 hours? As for the CMD tri-fuel conversion, instruction, and support: C- at best.

If anyone has other advice to help the cold start on LPG - please bring it. This is the reason I signed up for the forum....

Why so many hours? check us out >> The Cliffhouse at Bear CreekBroken Bow, OK - Broken Bow Cabins
 

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Ok, well, update time:

I finally got my outside NG shutoff valve, quick connect, and hose set up, so today I tried out the generator on natural gas.

I had already adjusted the load block per the CMD instructions (1/4 turn per engine HP).

It wouldn't start. So then I disconnected the auto-choke and made sure the actuator was fully clockwise (viewed from top) to open the vane. (Thanks to Sixto for the instructions!)

Still wouldn't start.

Next I started unscrewing the load block screw.

What a pain in the @ss!! I finally got it started, with ~ 10 screw grooves showing on the load block. While trying to start it there a bunch of loud "backfires" and it looked like the air box cover (the one with those clips) was going to blow off! I'm sure this isn't good for the generator but I don't know how to prevent it.

Next, I turned off the generator and tried to start it while warm. No go. I again had to fiddle endlessly with the load block.

Once I got it going I let the battery charge, since I'm sure all the starting attempts drained it. After a while I turned it off and let it cool down.

Next I tried cold starting. No go. 10 minutes of load block fiddling (again!) to get it running.

After that I gave up for the day.

It seems like the sweet spot once I get it running is 10 - 11 grooves. But it won't start (hot or cold) when set there. I think I have to back it out even more to start and then bring it back in once running to smooth it out.

Does anyone have an insight or suggestions? I spent a lot of money on the CMD kit and NG plumbing, and right now I'm fighting the feeling that it was a waste. :(




I won't be able to test anything until I get the plumber to do the NG hookup, but I followed the CMD instructions for setting the load block - screw all the way in, then back out 1/4 turn for each HP of the engine.

This exposed 6 grooves between the lock nut and top of screw. I know Sixto said he has ~10 grooves exposed. I'll post back once I get to try it out...
 

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What size NG quick disconnect on house? Size hose? Length of hose? Size of connection into regulator?

Mine are all 3/4 and the 3/4 hose is 15 feet.

You should be able to get it working. I just tested mine last weekend, and it started cold perfectly. I pressed the manual primer a few times, and then I just let it crank for about 20-30 seconds and it started right up, and ran for 15-20 minutes fine.

You'll figure this out. Mine did take some time to get it right, but I now never need to touch the load block.

The only change that I made was I did switch from the Garretson regulator 038-122 to the 039-31173-1 which supports 4oz, "-1" for manual feed. Not sure if that helped but everything works fine now.
 

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Hi Sixto!

Thanks for responding so quickly...

The plumber T'd into the 3/4" NG gas line, but the piping is 1/2". He had to add maybe 4' (max) of 1/2" line to reach the outside of the house. From there, I have an 8', 1/2" quick connect hose all the way to the generator.

Does this give you any insight?

Should I try the alternate regulator you suggested?

Did you have to do anything special with the spark plug? After some googling I read something about using a spark plug with a different gap measurement for NG versus gasoline...

Regards,

-dan


What size NG quick disconnect on house? Size hose? Length of hose? Size of connection into regulator?

Mine are all 3/4 and the 3/4 hose is 15 feet.

You should be able to get it working. I just tested mine last weekend, and it started cold perfectly. I pressed the manual primer a few times, and then I just let it crank for about 20-30 seconds and it started right up, and ran for 15-20 minutes fine.

You'll figure this out. Mine did take some time to get it right, but I now never need to touch the load block.

The only change that I made was I did switch from the Garretson regulator 038-122 to the 039-31173-1 which supports 4oz, "-1" for manual feed. Not sure if that helped but everything works fine now.
 

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Sixto,

Did I read that right? You let the generator crank for 20 to 30 seconds?

I only let it crank for 4 or 5, and if it doesn't start I wait and try again.

Am I doing it wrong??

Hi Sixto!

Thanks for responding so quickly...

The plumber T'd into the 3/4" NG gas line, but the piping is 1/2". He had to add maybe 4' (max) of 1/2" line to reach the outside of the house. From there, I have an 8', 1/2" quick connect hose all the way to the generator.

Does this give you any insight?

Should I try the alternate regulator you suggested?

Did you have to do anything special with the spark plug? After some googling I read something about using a spark plug with a different gap measurement for NG versus gasoline...

Regards,

-dan
 

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They recommend 3/4" the entire way, but not sure that's your problem, I'd think that would more effect total capacity.

For the spark plug gap I did change mine to 20ish, but also not sure that's your problem either.

Yep, I do need to let it crank a little but it does eventually start for me. And if I try a second time then I make sure to press the manual primer a few more times again.

You should try on propane, I used that first to make sure everything was working fine, before I invested in the NG setup.

You also need to take it very slow, with only little changes at a time, and patience.

Good luck.
 

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Dkuster, try starting first on gasoline and then cutting over to NG after it warms up. To do so, you will need a shut off on the line between the regulator and carb. I have the US carb set up and it is very tricky to get set up correctly. I can get it started with NG, but I found starting on gasoline then fine tuning on NG the first few times speeds up the adjustment process. Plus this will give you the assurance it can run on NG?

My EU6500 runs best on NG with the choke set at about 8:00 when standing in front of the door that exposes the choke and looking down. These EU6500s are tough NG set ups. I still question if I should have spent a few bucks more and gone for the full auto standby.
 

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Hi Sixto,

The supplemental instructions that came with my CMD kit specify 3/8" hose from the regulator to the fuel supply. So with 1/2" hose I would think I'm fine. It's an 8' hose from the generator to the quick-connect on the house.

I'll try adjusting it again. Maybe I can get it where it will both start and run. My adjustments might have been too course.

I'll also see if a different spark plug gap helps. It looks like that alternate garretson regulator is about $90. I might try that as a last resort.

Should I mess with the adjustment screw on the front of the regulator, or leave that alone??

Thanks for all the help. I'll look into getting a propane tank and hose as well...

-dan



They recommend 3/4" the entire way, but not sure that's your problem, I'd think that would more effect total capacity.

For the spark plug gap I did change mine to 20ish, but also not sure that's your problem either.

Yep, I do need to let it crank a little but it does eventually start for me. And if I try a second time then I make sure to press the manual primer a few more times again.

You should try on propane, I used that first to make sure everything was working fine, before I invested in the NG setup.

You also need to take it very slow, with only little changes at a time, and patience.

Good luck.
 

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You should try Propane first, for me it was perfect, then I moved on to NG.

The only reason that I switched the regulator was because I didn't think that it was reacting to significant fluctuations in load quickly enough, but honestly I'm not sure much changed with the new regulator. Same with the spark plug gap, just not sure what effect that had.

When I turned off the choke, all my starting problems went away.
 

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Hi Jackruf,

Thanks for the reply. I'm trying to not have to start on gas to avoid the risk of gumming up the carb on stale fuel, but if I have to I'll explore that option. So, you're saying I would have to cut the hose somewhere between the regulator output and the carb and install a shutoff valve, correct? And then to switch between gasoline and NG you quickly shut off the gasoline supply using the knob on the 6500 control panel and open the NG valve at the same time?

So, if I read you right your choke is not fully open, but slightly closed down? My auto-choke is currently disabled and the vane is fully open. Sounds like there's yet another variable to play with :rolleyes:



Dkuster, try starting first on gasoline and then cutting over to NG after it warms up. To do so, you will need a shut off on the line between the regulator and carb. I have the US carb set up and it is very tricky to get set up correctly. I can get it started with NG, but I found starting on gasoline then fine tuning on NG the first few times speeds up the adjustment process. Plus this will give you the assurance it can run on NG?

My EU6500 runs best on NG with the choke set at about 8:00 when standing in front of the door that exposes the choke and looking down. These EU6500s are tough NG set ups. I still question if I should have spent a few bucks more and gone for the full auto standby.
 

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Correct, put a ball valve in supply hose between regulator and carb and close it when you start with gas. Let it warm up on gas, shut the gasoline valve and open the ball valve. It will putter for a few moments as the gas is depleted and the NG takes over. You can then adjust the NG to run smooth. I too wanted to avoid gasoline at all costs, but I finally gave in. I purchased a few quarts of the ethyenol free gas from Home Depot to keep in the tank. With regard to the choke -- I disconnected auto and found it runs best at 8:00 position.

I don't think you have a supply issue.
 

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Discussion Starter #99
I'm trying to not have to start on gas to avoid the risk of gumming up the carb on stale fuel, but if I have to I'll explore that option.
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but when you switch "during run" from gasoline to NG, won't any gas in the carb cycle through it meaning that there will be no fuel in the carb to gum up?
 

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Peter, you are correct. That is why I don't worry about gumming up the carb. The gas in the carb is depleted when you shut the gas valve off and all residual should burn off. Just need to remember to periodically drain the tank.

The US Carb website states that some generators will not start on NG or Propane and need to warm up on gasoline before switching over.
 
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