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Discussion Starter #1
Hi folks,

I live in Florida, and want to be prepared for hurricane season this time around. I've had a hard cutover installed for the electrical panel w/ 50A service installed outside by the garage. I will have the gas folks tee off the pool heater for fuel. I also had a hard-start installed on the AC unit to help with the compressor drawing too much power at start-up.

So my question: I've seen conversion kits from these folks: https://centuryfuelproducts.com/generators/conversion-kits and a lot of them say the frame needs to be cut, which I want to avoid if at all possible.

Anyone have some thoughts on the best generator for what I'm trying to accomplish? As usual, looking for the happy medium between cost and reliability/performance.

Thanks,
Jason
 

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Discussion Starter #3
thanks for the suggestion … do you know which kit would fit that model? I certainly like the price point compared to other options!
 

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Fully understand somethings are not as simple as they first seem. Teeing off may not be an option due to pressure an flow requirements of the gen set. Most I have installed will not run under much load plumed up that way. The other thing you need to check out, is talk to the engine mfg an see if a timing change has to be made if your converting an engine over to LP or Natural. Why? Because depending upon combustion chamber design or compression ratio a timing change may be required and on some engines it's not that simple at all. Engine sold that are designed for different fuel you'll have no issue with, however not all engines will convert an pull their max HP on that new fuel w/o a change or two.
 

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The OP states "NG", which I assume he is referring to natural gas.
The Doromax lists "dual fuel" as being gasoline or propane.
My question: Is there a compatability problem between propane and natural gas? Are the two interchangeable?
 

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Yes, major difference between NG & LP depending engine RPM an design. 3600 rpm units that will run both fuels, normally have a wire that will change the timing between the two different fuels. If it does not have the wire, most will not even come close to pulling even a small load. The install/operation manual will have the info about how to change the timing if so equipped. Before buying any genset ask them about how the way your going to operate it, that way if there's an issue you can fall back on them vs spending a large chunk of money that is not what you want or need. Education is the key and is sorely lacking in the small EPG market most here talk about or are in.
 

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There are no portable generators out of the box compatible with natural gas. You will require a conversion kit. I highly recommend UScarburetion for an appropriate kit. Their “snorkel” eliminates the need for a bulky adapter. Don’t bother with a dual fuel generator save the money and buy a tri fuel kit.

The question is, does your pool heaters gas line support the demand of a generator. We need to know from the meter the size of the pipes and length of that diameter pipe up to where you plan to tee in. It’s also important to understand that elbows need to be considered if your pipe is on the small side.

A true 12k generator will have a 18hp engine requiring a minumum 180CFH (180,000btuh.) You need to be sure that your gas plumbing will support that. Also consider your meter is likely a 250CFH, so make sure you don’t run too many gas appliances at the same time as the generator.

The duromax 12000 is a 9500watt continuous generator. It’s advertised 18hp is bogus. More like 14-15 sae hp. So in this case minumum a minimum 140CFH supply is needed. It’s also important to understand that you need to derate the 9500 watts by 20%. NG has a lower BTU per volume content as compared to gasoline and propane.
 

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To those of you that are considering a conversion to NG or propane you might be advised that two pressure regulators are necessary for proper operation.
Just like pre regulating propane.
The US Carburator kit must be seccondary to a pre regulator that lowers the pressure.
Failure to drop pressure will result in a damaged US carb unit and render it useless.
Take it from a guy that blew up a US carb unit.
Some more knowledgable about regulators might shed some light on this.
 

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To those of you that are considering a conversion to NG or propane you might be advised that two pressure regulators are necessary for proper operation.
Just like pre regulating propane.
The US Carburator kit must be seccondary to a pre regulator that lowers the pressure.
Failure to drop pressure will result in a damaged US carb unit and render it useless.
Take it from a guy that blew up a US carb unit.
Some more knowledgable about regulators might shed some light on this.
The KN demand regulators use a max of 11” water column (< 1/2psi. )

If running off a propane cylinder 20, 30, 40 100lb tanks, a low pressure single stage regulator is required.

I have a 500gallon tank that feeds my house. It uses a high pressure regulator to drop tank pressure to 10psi which feeds a low pressure regulator before entering the house at about 9” water column.

Most natural gas systems operate at 7” water column.
 

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The OP states "NG", which I assume he is referring to natural gas.
The Doromax lists "dual fuel" as being gasoline or propane.
My question: Is there a compatability problem between propane and natural gas? Are the two interchangeable?
You would likely need a separate regulator to run it on natural gas. Many have used the U.S. Carburetion kit:
As @drmerdp mentions, there are other considerations, as well. If you didn't want to start with a hybrid unit, they also have gas-only units:
XP12000E: https://www.duromaxpower.com/collections/home-backup/products/duromax-xp12000e-12000-watt-18-hp-portable-gas-generator
XP13000E: https://www.duromaxpower.com/collections/home-backup/products/duromax-xp13000e-13000-watt-portable-gas-electric-start-generator
XP15000E: https://www.duromaxpower.com/collections/home-backup/products/duromax-xp15000e-15000-watt-v-twin-gas-powered-electric-start-portable-generator
 

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It uses a high pressure regulator to drop tank pressure to 15psi which feeds a low pressure regulator before entering the house at about 9” water column.
That is interesting as most first stage regulators are adjusted to output 10psi max. The second stage that is used with a first stage has a normal input of 10 psi without put between 7"-11" h2o. If you over pressure a second stage regulator many of them will not operate properly. A two stage regulator combines operations both at the tank if the piping run is short. LP regulators can be used on NG but most of the time you will not have the correct spring to convert one unless your in the industry, an even then you have to know the color that goes with that mfg's reg. On some models the demand reg is operated w/o the spring on LP, but on NG the spring has to be installed with the tulip up an output pressure has to de adjusted to 5" h2O positive pressure, vs a negative when using LP. Most NG meters can be quickly changed at the panel from 7-11" H2O output to 2psi output. Then the down stream has to have 2psi to 7-11" h2O regs installed when adding gen sets over 5-8KW depending piping run an size. Bottom line read the mfgs manual or talk to their service people before/when installing, designing, or trying to repair anything. Gas systems are very safe but only if installed properly. Many stories out there of what can go wrong when installed improperly, an many lives have been lost as well.
 

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About pressure regulators:
First off I have no formal training on pressure regulators.
Inches of water column is greek to me.
Like KRE says there is a regulator at the input line of the NG.
My Generac has a regulator in the line that feeds it.
I decided that the more gas the better my ES 6500 would run.
So, I bypassed the Generac regulator and connected my US Carb directly to the House gas line for the Honda supply.
Boom! No more US Carb regulator. Destroyed.
Had to replace it at $50.
I do not mess with regulators as they are above my level of knowledge.
 

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That is interesting as most first stage regulators are adjusted to output 10psi max. The second stage that is used with a first stage has a normal input of 10 psi without put between 7"-11" h2o. If you over pressure a second stage regulator many of them will not operate properly. A two stage regulator combines operations both at the tank if the piping run is short. LP regulators can be used on NG but most of the time you will not have the correct spring to convert one unless your in the industry, an even then you have to know the color that goes with that mfg's reg. On some models the demand reg is operated w/o the spring on LP, but on NG the spring has to be installed with the tulip up an output pressure has to de adjusted to 5" h2O positive pressure, vs a negative when using LP. Most NG meters can be quickly changed at the panel from 7-11" H2O output to 2psi output. Then the down stream has to have 2psi to 7-11" h2O regs installed when adding gen sets over 5-8KW depending piping run an size. Bottom line read the mfgs manual or talk to their service people before/when installing, designing, or trying to repair anything. Gas systems are very safe but only if installed properly. Many stories out there of what can go wrong when installed improperly, an many lives have been lost as well.
My mistake it is 10psi.
 

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Lots of good advice here. You're certainly going to need some serious supply for that engine involving a larger-than-normal house meter and then dedicated piping of substantial size (I'm thinking at least 1-1/4") to supply that. You should be able to take NG off of the meter with the appropriate kit installed like a Motorsnorkle.



I converted my Honda 6500 to NG at my last home and it required 1 inch piping for supply. And, it maxed out my meter.


I'm now using LP from a 500 gal tank and that runs to a step down regulator that I plug my 1" supply hose into.



There are calculators out there for the piping. Also, you can contact US Carboration with questions on how to prep and size...
 

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My home set is a 25KW unit. I had the gas company change the meter to 2psi output, it's a simple screw turn on most meters. I then split the discharge piping an placed a 7-11" H2O reg to fed the home, but ran the 2psi to the gen set. Piping run was 30' with 4 90*'s. The pipe is 1" an is over kill for this gen-set. I went with 1" as I may remove the 25kw an install a 40KW for larger machinery operation should I decide to up grade. 2 PSI of N/G will support way more than most any home gen-set requires. The thing most gas company's forget is a gen-set has to have the correct pressure an flow, on demand. I can not tell you how many installs I have been to where front money was wasted due to lack of education. That goes for units that have been installed an never ran right for years upon years as well. One install cost the home owner over $25K to install everything. It would not preform to design. We were called in an the whole system had to be corrected to the tune of over $30K more. It was no where near your average setup granted, but the bottom line all the front money was mostly for not. Do it right the first time, an be done with it.
 
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